Tri-union gods and Pagan, Christian, Muslim and Jewish views on the Creator God

Yesterday we looked at those who have questions about God and how the Christadelphians try to give them an answer and offer a platform where questions can be asked.

When you look at the world of those who claim that they worship the True God, we may find Jews, Christians and Muslims. Though by the Christians and Mohammedans questions may arise. Next to Christianity we can see Christendom where there are people who call themselves Christian, and often consider themselves part of Christianity, though do not really follow the teachings of Christ (the Kristos) Jesus, whose original name is Jeshua from Nazareth, from the tribe of king David. Those so called Christians do believe in a tri-une god, like before the time of Jesus there have been also many others who believed in some three-une or three-headed gods, but of which the Bible say that they are false gods and that there is Only One True God, the God of Israel, Who is One (and as such not two, three, eight or more).

trinity-doctrine-found-in-most-pagan-religionsOf those trinitarians there are who do not seem to know about other three-headed gods, and others who claim that their tri-union god is different because he would be having all the same qualities in each personality. Though than then they do seem to miss that the god they claim to be omnipotent, omnipresent, and as omniscient all knowing, at certain points said he did not know it, though they claim he would never lie. If god knows everything (what God does) and Jesus would be God than Jesus would know when he would come back, he would know when the end-times are, he would know who would be saved, he would know who would be seated next to him, he would know he is a spirit, though he clearly stated he is no spirit and does not know all those matters, because it is only known to the Spirit God, Who has no beginning, can not be tempted, can not be done any thing by man, can not die, though Jesus was tempted many times, was killed by man (or faked his death), was three days in hell (not exactly a place for God to be), was taken out of the dead (God never be able to be death would not exactly be under the dead, is it not?), would have been taken in to the heaven to come to sit next to God (though when Jesus is God then he would sit on his own throne never next to himself but at the place of himself).

Dattatreya
Dattatreya or Dattā, deity by people from India and Nepal, having Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva in him

Those Christians who think their tri-union god or tri-une godhead is different than the other three-headed gods, like several tri-une Hindu gods (a.o. Brahma, Trisiras and Dattatreya);

Triglav - a Slav three-headed warrior god
Triglav – a Slav three-headed warrior god

or European Slav and Celtic gods like Ambisagrus or Jupiter Optimus Maximus, Nantosuelta, goddess of nature, the earth, fire, and fertility in Gaul, Triglav the three-headed warrior god, or Thor, should think twice and compare the attributes contributed to those gods and theirs, which seem to be very similar.
In several pagan religions we do find a trinity with a god father or god mother, a god son or a god word and a god spirit or god light or god thought or soul.

The Bible also speaks of such trinitarian gods like Nimrod. The Word of the One True God calls him

“a mighty hunter in opposition to Jehovah”

We can see that in 4th C.C.E., at the Council of Nicea of Constantine Christendom simply picked up the idea of tri-une gods to win over the pagans. They suddenly made YHWH Jehovah, Jesus and the Holy Spirit 3 persons in one godhead.

brahma-creator-god-forom-hinduism
Tri-une Hindu god who is considered the creator god, but also by other groups has four faces. He is also known as Svayambhu (self-born), Vāgīśa (Lord of Speech), and the creator of the four Vedas, one from each of his mouths

Question is if tri-une gods like the creator god Brahma or the Indian Mandhata represent the same Creator God Jehovah, but just under an other name?

Maybe similarities between Kama and Cupid, Vishwakarma and Vulcan and Indra and Zeus may lead many to hastily conclude that Hindu mythology is similar to Greek mythology. It is said that the Greeks believed in polytheism, the belief in many gods, but many Hindus say they believe in one god and as such should belong to monotheism. For them like for trinitarian Christians their god is one god who appears in different forms. For Hindu religious people their one god shows the world the different aspects of the supreme Brahmanthe supreme existence or absolute reality, avatars or incarnation of this deity on earth, like certain Christians take Jesus as the incarnation of their god or of their supreme being. In the earliest Vedic literature, all supernatural beings are called Asuras, mythological lord beings. in the Vedic religion of India and in later Hinduism, one of many gods, often roughly divided into sky, air, and earth divinities on the basis of their identification with the forces of nature. In the pantheistic systems that emerged by the Late Vedic period, the devas became subordinate to the one supreme being. 

We can see that those who want to defend the Trinity search for their answers in a lot of philosophical human tangle of thought, like in the article “The Trinity Logically Defended” where they go into numerology (a thought of man) instead of using God’s Word to show their way of thinking would be right. The writer Renassault, at Reasoned ruminations, claims the other tri-une gods may not exist whilst his tri-une god exist, though he does not evince it at all, nor does he give any proof the other deities would not exist. For him moreover, the philosopher who popularized Nominalism to the present day, the  medieval French scholastic philosopher, theologian and preeminent logician Peter Abelard, considered the past and future to be just as non-existent universals as numbers, so do we have to accept that the past nor the future exist? And what has this to do with the reality of a tri-une god or with the existence of the Real One God who created the being and the elements man uses to divide time?

The writer of the above mentioned article The Trinity Logically Defended says he is not arguing that what he says proves there must have been a God who created everything/something at all. But he writes

I’m only pointing out that the answer is the same logically consistent answer as how the Trinity can be true and non-contradictory. If the cause that originated the universe was eternal, why did it create the universe in this way? Randomly and arbitrarily you say? But if there were an infinite number of possible random variations, like Zeno’s Paradox, how was one even “picked”? {The Trinity Logically Defended}

For him the answer of it all lies in or deals with the Trinity. He also does not seem to believe man would ever be able to follow God’s commandments. With that thinking he implies God demanded from the start something He knew man would never be able to keep, which makes of this God a very cruel God.

For that writer the God

Father is the source of the Trinity and the Son and Spirit both have their source in the Father, yet without a point in time being created. The three person all have the same Will—that of the Father, they cannot contradict each other, or operate independently, they only do the Father’s will. {The Trinity Logically Defended}

In many other faiths where they worship a three headed god they also claim their gods being from the same source and having the equal powers, having the same will. He claims his tri-union god cannot contradict each other though we see Jesus claiming God is greater than him, which would be a contradiction if Jesus is that same God. At one point Jesus also prays to God and says that he wants that the Will of God shall be done and not his (Jesus) will. In case Jesus is God it shall always God’s or his will.

Nowhere does he proof that

Christ also confesses He has a second another will–that of a human. {The Trinity Logically Defended}

In several defences of those who believe in a tri-une god, we never come to see a real logical explanation or a real clear Biblical explanation of that three-headed construction. Having another will than that of God would make the god those trinitarians adhere not having a god of the same will, like the other trinitarian gods in polytheism.

A monotheist religion should only be called this way when it really has one (mono) god as the main figure to be worshipped. Jews, Christians and Muslims claim to be part of the monotheist religions.

It is not bad to have a look at what those religions teach about their God. At the end of 2016 two websites got to see the light of this world. One tries to look at the God of the Muslim world in comparison to the God of the Christian world. That new site, dares to pose many questions and wants people to look at possible answers many communities offer for the questions which are on many believers and non-believers lips. Questiontime-Vragenuurtje is there for you to ask your questions and to go in dialogue. A Lastige Vragensteller or a Troublesome Inquirer takes the floor and shall bring quotes for the Quran as well as the Christian Bible to put answers from Scriptures in the spotlight.

question-time-20161201-opening-day

Some of the vital questions already posed are:

  1. The first question: Why do we live
  2. 2nd question: What or where is the beginning
  3. 3rd question: Does there exist a Divine Creator
  4. Is there no ‘proof’ for God? (And why that statement is not as smart as you might think.)

and some of the answers already posed:

  1. Looking for answers on the question Is there a God #1 Many gods
  2. Looking for answers on the question Is there a God #2 Pantheon of gods and celebrations
  3. Have no other gods besides Me
  4. Nature Is A Reflection Of God

Immanuel Verbondskind looks at the difference between the Jewish tradition and Christian faith and the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Who according to the Holy Scriptures was also the God of rabbi Jeshua, Jesus Christ and his disciples, though the tri-une god of many Christians would never be the God of the Jews.

immanuel-theme-able-20161226-1630-5

Immanuel started at his site to explain that having the name Immanuel does not mean that person is God.  After having looked at “Called Immanuel does not mean to be Jesus being God” he opened with a series on how to read the Holy Scriptures, this with the idea that to come to know the Real True God and to find out who Jesus really is, he thinks it is “Best to read and study the Bible

Immanuel Verbondskind shall look at the teaching of the different Christian denominations and compare them to the teachings of the Jewish rabbi Jeshua, better know today as Jesus Christ. Jesus and his disciples their knowledge of the Hebrew Scriptures plays an important role in how shall be looked at the distortions which may have come into Christendom. Immanuel shall take those basic Judaic Scriptures and examine what the chosen pupils of Jesus made out of it and what they wrote down in the Messianic Scriptures, better known by many Christians as the New Testament. He shall not be averse to look at Jewish traditions and other Jewish literature or theological works, comparing it with Christian theological works and Christian traditions to find out how they fit in the way of thinking of the Messiah Jeshua, the Christ Jesus.

Both new blogs should be a good asset to come to know the divine Creator and to come to know how Jehovah God relates to Jesus and Jesus to the world.

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Preceding

A Start for looking at the unseen and the treasure to look forward to

Relating to God is it possible

Can you question the existence of God

Are there certain books essential to come to faith

A King who wanted to extol a King above all kings

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Find a.o.

  1. Christadelphian Yuku Platform
  2. Trinity matter
  3. Questiontime-Vragenuurtje
  4. Immanuel Verbondskind

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Additional reading

  1. Only One God
  2. God is only One
  3. Attributes to God
  4. Glory of only One God Who gives His Word
  5. People Seeking for God 3 Laws and directions
  6. Christianity without the Trinity
  7. Hellenistic influences
  8. Germanic mythological influences up to today’s Christmas celebrations
  9. Our World: Jewish and Christian traditions of elders
  10. Denominationalism exists because?
  11. Silence, devotion, Salafists, quietists, weaponry, bombings, books, writers and terrorists
  12. Jesus three days in hell
  13. Eostre, Easter, White god, chocolate eggs, Easter bunnies and metaphorical resurrection
  14. Revelation 1:8 – Who is Speaking?
  15. How did the Trinity Doctrine Develop
  16. History of the acceptance of a three-in-one God
  17. Altered to fit a Trinity
  18. It happened on May 2 295
  19. 1691 years ago on June the 20th in 325
  20. Necessity of a revelation of creation 2 Organisation of a system of things
  21. Framework and vehicle for Christian Scholasticism and loss of confidence
  22. How Did Jesus Become White? By Richard Stockton
  23. Problems correspondents have with the Trinity Doctrine

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Further reading
  1. Three-headed gods
  2. Three Headed Hindu God Shiva :Tri Mukhi Hindu Lord Mahadev
  3. Lakshmi Maa
  4. Triglav – The Three Headed God
  5. Pokristjanjevanje alpskih Slovanov
  6. Is God comprised of three persons, or is He just one person?
  7. The Trinity: paganism or Christianity?
  8. The History of the Development of the Trinity Doctrine
  9. Trinity And Pagan Influence
  10. James White and John 1:1 Regarding “Was”
  11. John 1:1,2 – The Word was Mighty
  12. John 4:26 – EGO EIMI and Jesus’ Claim to be the Messiah
  13. Luke 1:35 and the Trinity
  14. The Real Reasons for Not Believing the Trinity
  15. The God of Jesus
  16. Questions for those who believe in the Trinity
  17. “If God Exists”
  18. Who Created God and What Existed Before Him
  19. The Trinity Logically Defended
  20. Christianity – Nature of God
  21. A Perfect Example of Acedia
  22. Edward Gibbon on religion in the Roman Empire
  23. The Lie of White Identity
  24. Njord God of… Fire?
  25. Henotheology!
  26. Twelfth Night & Wassail
  27. Christmas: a miracle of understanding
  28. Merry Christmas 2016
  29. Surah 16:71 – How Could The Creator Be Compared to created?
  30. How is that God? Objections and Responses to the Argument From Change
  31. Reblog: Many Gods

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Welcome to this WordPress site

Welcome and thanks for coming to have a look at this sibling-site of Relating to God.

Explaining the Christadelphian Aims on Relating to God page.
Explaining the Christadelphian Aims on Relating to God page.

The Belgian Christadelphians following up the task Jesus gave his disciples to go out in the world and to preach the gospel of the coming Kingdom of God, want to let God’s Name be known all over the world and let people enjoy the hope Jesus has given to the world by offering himself as a ransom for the sins of man.

Relating to God (Weebly website) Tools page
Relating to God (Weebly website) Tools page

With Relating to God (on Weebly) and here on WordPress, we want to show people the importance of coming into good relationships with each other and with the Divine Maker of all things. On both platforms we would like to hand out some tools to help each other to come on the right track and to see that the Way to God is Jeshua, the Kristos, better known as Jesus Christ, the Messiah.

When you are looking for God and want to find Him for connecting with Him, we advise to use His Own Tool, He provide already in the past centuries. The Best Tool God Himself provided is His Word, presented to us in a divine library of 66 books (39 in Hebrew and/or Aramaic and 27 in Hebrew). It has become a best-seller of all times though many people never read it. In case more people would read it there would be less problems on earth. We would like to bring people so far that they go to look in their Bible for answers and to compare those things what are said by human beings and what is really said by the Divine Author or the Holy Scriptures, Who is a God Who does not tell lies.

19 God is not like a man, so that he would lie, nor is he like a son of man, so that he would be changed. Therefore, having spoken, will he not act? Has he ever spoken, and not fulfilled? (Numbers 23:19 CPDV)

Relating to God (Weebly website) God of gods page.
Relating to God (Weebly website) God of gods page.

This God of gods Who is not a man of flesh and blood, but a Spirit, has given His word so that man can learn from it. And that is what we should do and help each individual to understand that it is God His Word they should listen to more than to words of man who like to bring forward their own dogma’s.

We would love people to accept the Words written as they are in the Bible, having them to come to see Who is who and having them to accept those Bible characters for what and who  they are, always taking as their guide and remembering the Word of God.

24 God is Spirit. And so, those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.”  (John 4.24 CPDV)

19 He responded: “I will show you all that is good, and I will call out with the name of the Lord before you. And I will take pity on whomever I will, and I will be lenient to whomever it will please me.”
20 And again he said: “You are not able to see my face. For man shall not see me and live.”  (Exodus 33:20 CPDV)

16 In all things, take up the shield of faith, with which you may be able to extinguish all the fiery darts of the most wicked one.
17 And take up the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit (which is the Word of God).
18 Through every kind of prayer and supplication, pray at all times in spirit, and so be vigilant with every kind of earnest supplication, for all the saints,  (Ephesians 6:16-18 CPDV)

12 For the Word of God is living and effective: more piercing than any two-edged sword, reaching to the division even between the soul and the spirit, even between the joints and the marrow, and so it discerns the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
13 And there is no created thing that is invisible to his sight. For all things are naked and open to the eyes of him, about whom we are speaking.
14 Therefore, since we have a great High Priest, who has pierced the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, we should hold to our confession.
15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to have compassion on our infirmities, but rather one who was tempted in all things, just as we are, yet without sin.
16 Therefore, let us go forth with confidence toward the throne of grace, so that we may obtain mercy, and find grace, in a helpful time.  (Hebbrews 4:12-16)

16 All Scripture, having been divinely inspired, is useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in justice,
17 so that the man of God may be perfect, having been trained for every good work.   (2 Timothy 3:16-17 CPDV)

To come to a good relationship with somebody we may not twist the words  that person speaks, the same for the biblical characters, when they say something we should not think something else. For example when God says that Jesus is His begotten son we should also read and accept that Jesus is the son of God and not making it in “being the god son“.

We should believe what is written in God’s Word, the Bible and should know that there shall come a time that people will not want to know about what is really written in it and would prefer to follow the teachings of men, like words of theologians.

3 For there shall be a time when they will not endure sound doctrine, but instead, according to their own desires, they will gather to themselves teachers, with itching ears,
4 and certainly, they will turn their hearing away from the truth, and they will be turned toward fables. (2 Timothy 4:3-4 CPDV)

Therefore we ask you to let our words settle and if you find something we say or write different from what you were taught, or perhaps even shocking, please do check everything we say with the Bible, and get your knowledge from that Word of God. At this site you are also welcome to ask your questions or give your remarks, if you have them, at the end of each article. We shall appreciate your contribution.

7 The beginning of wisdom is to obtain wisdom, and, with all that you possess, to acquire prudence. 8 Grasp her, and she will exalt you. You will be glorified by her, when you have embraced her. (Proverbs 4:7-8 CPDV)

3 For if you would call upon wisdom and bend your heart to prudence, 4 if you will seek her like money, and dig for her as if for treasure, 5 then you will understand the fear of the Lord, and you will discover the knowledge of God.
6 For the Lord bestows wisdom, and out of his mouth, prudence and knowledge.
7 He will preserve the salvation of the righteous, and he will protect those who walk in simplicity: 8 serving the paths of justice, and guarding the ways of sanctity.
9 Then you shall understand justice and judgment, and equity, and every good path.
10 If wisdom is to enter into your heart, and if knowledge is to become pleasing to your soul, 11 then counsel must guard you, and prudence must serve you, 12 so that you may be rescued from the evil way, and from the man who speaks perversities, 13 from those who leave the straight path to walk in dark ways, 14 who rejoice when they have done evil, and who exult in the most wicked things.  (Proverbs 2:3-10 CPDV)

We would love those coming along our sites to join us on the climb to above. We do believe we should take the Bible as a book to be set apart (to be holy)

5 Every word of God is fire-tested. He is a bronze shield to those who hope in him.
6 Do not add anything to his words, lest you be reproved and be discovered to be a liar. (Proverbs 30:5-6 CPDV)

2 so that your ears may listen to wisdom, then bend your heart in order to know prudence. 3 For if you would call upon wisdom and bend your heart to prudence, 4 if you will seek her like money, and dig for her as if for treasure, 5 then you will understand the fear of the Lord, and you will discover the knowledge of God.
6 For the Lord bestows wisdom, and out of his mouth, prudence and knowledge.
7 He will preserve the salvation of the righteous, and he will protect those who walk in simplicity: 8 serving the paths of justice, and guarding the ways of sanctity.
9 Then you shall understand justice and judgment, and equity, and every good path.
10 If wisdom is to enter into your heart, and if knowledge is to become pleasing to your soul, 11 then counsel must guard you, and prudence must serve you, 12 so that you may be rescued from the evil way, and from the man who speaks perversities, 13 from those who leave the straight path to walk in dark ways, 14 who rejoice when they have done evil, and who exult in the most wicked things. (Micha 4:2-14 CPDV)

We endeavour to present ourself approved to God, a workman not made ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth and do hope to bring others to God by looking forward they too will share that Word with the true message in the right way.

15 Be solicitous in the task of presenting yourself before God as a proven and unashamed worker who has handled the Word of Truth correctly. (2 Timothy 2:15 CPDV)

 

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In case you want to know more about the Christadelphians, you may find it useful to read:

  1. Who are the Christadelphians
  2. What are Brothers in Christ
  3. Christadelphian people
  4. What Christadelphians Believe
  5. The Faith of Christadelphians
  6. Christadelphian History

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